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  1. #21
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    I don't want to derail the thread.

    buuuuuuut....

    *Inhales*


    "Separate the art from the artist" is a term terribly lost in "HashtagCurrentYear" and it is truly a shame. Do I think Channel Awesome is a cornucopia of a-holery? Absolutely. But i have been enjoying their content since they started and some of their latest videos had peaked my interest. I enjoyed the Jem and the Holograms review he did, I enjoyed his old content like Alone in the Dark, Battlefield Earth and others, I should not be chastised for liking them even though i never liked the people putting out said content. I liked "The I.T. Crowd" even though i wish Graham Linehan would rot in hell. When i played FEZ i had some fun while still despising the ever loving douchebaggery given the flesh that is Phil Fish. It works both ways of the political spectrum.

    And on the same topic of Change the Channel, no one can deny that while with good intentions, the other side did not do it for the "truth to come out" solely, they wanted their 15 minutes restarted, and for some of them it worked. And on that side they also had their skeletons well documented. While one side may have misogyny the other had grave standing for political purposes. One side may have ill intent but the other had a defender of a documented pedophile while also saying that they kept quiet about a then alleged predator because "gooblegator". Both sides have problem and personally I couldn't care less about either one. That should not stop me to like what i want to like.


    ...And now back to your regularly scheduled thread.
    Last edited by Blue Buster; 05-11-2018 at 03:36 AM.
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  2. #22
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    People don't like the Nostalgia Critic anymore?

    ...please please please tell me nobody likes Linkara either.

    edit: Oh my god this Channel Awesome Sucks Google Doc I just found is the greatest thing I have ever read.
    Last edited by Question; 05-11-2018 at 08:29 AM.

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  4. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Question View Post
    People don't like the Nostalgia Critic anymore?

    ...please please please tell me nobody likes Linkara either.

    edit: Oh my god this Channel Awesome Sucks Google Doc I just found is the greatest thing I have ever read.

    Yeah, the entirety of Channel Awesome basically imploded so many people are against Doug and crew now. Linkara, however, still seems to be on most people's ok lists, especially due to the fact that him leaving was one of the major triggers of the floodgate that brought the site down.

  5. #24
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    The best part was when a guy got fired so they had to escort a female employee to a safehouse and one of her escorts had a fucking sword.

    Most of it was shitty though.

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  6. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blue Buster View Post
    I don't want to derail the thread.

    buuuuuuut....

    *Inhales*


    "Separate the art from the artist" is a term terribly lost in "HashtagCurrentYear" and it is truly a shame. Do I think Channel Awesome is a cornucopia of a-holery? Absolutely. But i have been enjoying their content since they started and some of their latest videos had peaked my interest. I enjoyed the Jem and the Holograms review he did, I enjoyed his old content like Alone in the Dark, Battlefield Earth and others, I should not be chastised for liking them even though i never liked the people putting out said content. I liked "The I.T. Crowd" even though i wish Graham Linehan would rot in hell. When i played FEZ i had some fun while still despising the ever loving douchebaggery given the flesh that is Phil Fish. It works both ways of the political spectrum.

    And on the same topic of Change the Channel, no one can deny that while with good intentions, the other side did not do it for the "truth to come out" solely, they wanted their 15 minutes restarted, and for some of them it worked. And on that side they also had their skeletons well documented. While one side may have misogyny the other had grave standing for political purposes. One side may have ill intent but the other had a defender of a documented pedophile while also saying that they kept quiet about a then alleged predator because "gooblegator". Both sides have problem and personally I couldn't care less about either one. That should not stop me to like what i want to like.


    ...And now back to your regularly scheduled thread.
    I would just like to point out that, while the Nostalgia Critic's content is still pretty good (well I assume it is, I haven't been watching it), the fact still remains that if you watch his stuff, you are supporting Channel Awesome (now rebranding as The Nostalgia Critic from what I've heard). So, unfortunately, your argument of "separate the art from the artist" doesn't hold water because, right now, the best way to enjoy the art is to support the artist which I'm not going to do. And if you truly believe Channel Awesome is "a cornucopia of a-holery," you shouldn't either, no matter how much you like the content.


    Jigaku No Banken!

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  8. #26
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    Long weekend, after Mother's day, so sorry for the delay. I would like to tackle this part by part


    Quote Originally Posted by Shadow Ranger View Post
    I would just like to point out that, while the Nostalgia Critic's content is still pretty good (well I assume it is, I haven't been watching it), the fact still remains that if you watch his stuff, you are supporting Channel Awesome (now rebranding as The Nostalgia Critic from what I've heard).
    I will let my good friend Obi Wan Kenobi take over for this one:



    Supporting something would be if I donate to a patreon, buy merch or generally give money for a service. While this in comparison is just enjoying a free content that is out there, akin to watching a TV show. If i adopt the #AndrewDobson tactic of shutting out "problematic programming" my life (and by extension my entertainment options) would be rather dull.

    By that same line of thought, If by "supporting" someone i dislike by watching or reading about it, i would have been labeled a "raging communist" for doing an essay about Karl Marx in college and had to read his book or "Ultra violent degenerate" for watching Quentin Tarantino movies.

    So, unfortunately, your argument of "separate the art from the artist" doesn't hold water because, right now, the best way to enjoy the art is to support the artist which I'm not going to do. And if you truly believe Channel Awesome is "a cornucopia of a-holery," you shouldn't either, no matter how much you like the content.
    I stand by my words, i never liked any of those raging spergs and whatever they do behind the scenes shall be judged by history (and in some cases criminal justice when their time comes) but not by me. I have been watching the videos since 2008 and for some of them it helped me deal with personal problems that for those 15 - 20 minutes it made me forget whatever was going on my life, but once those videos ended, i moved on and consumed the next video or report from the internet, never giving a second glance.

    Again, my intention was not to derail this thread. Should it be necessary i would be more than happy to create a new one in the Off Topic sections. I have always been in favor of discussing sides and in a civil manner hash out any difference of opinions we may have. Just say the word
    Last edited by Blue Buster; 05-16-2018 at 12:49 AM.
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  9. #27
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    First of all, since I technically still call the shots, I don't mind anything derailing any thread. If it gets in the way, we can always split the thread, but since RV isn't exactly booming, stopping a discussion just because it isn't quite on topic is silly.

    As for Channel Awesome:
    Linkara was one of those content creators that weren't based in Chicago and therefore were paid in "exposure". He was on the same side of the deal as most people on that side, with just the Nostalgia Critic and any regular on that show being paid. Even those should be seen separate from management. Management was the main issue in this, and that does include Doug Walker (known as the Nostalgia Critic) and his brother, but not the other actors on screen in the Nostalgia Critic episodes.

    Obviously, for people standing by Channel Awesome through this (I doubt there are many), Linkara may be considered a dick. You can also think he's a dick for other things unrelated to this thing, but in general I think he's been in a positive light in this whole shabang.

    As said by many people, we shouldn't judge those who choose to stay with Channel Awesome, and the best way to support those who you like and might debate leaving or have left either prior to or since the implosion is to subscribe to their YouTubes and Patreons and what not.

    That said, I think it's selling them incredibly short by saying it was an attention grab. It seems that the main pushers were the ones who have set up a steady living since their dealings with Channel Awesome. While extra attention is obviously good for revenue with internet content, I very much doubt that was their motivation. Also, it's victim blaming, which is uncool.

    As for separating art from the artist, I don't agree with that idea in general. Aside from the fact that consuming their art directly benefits the artists in question, which means money in their pockets over bad business practices, I feel the background of an artist very much impacts the enjoyment of their art. No one can sit down and watch Jimmy Savile or Bill Cosby with a straight face. And while those are particularly extreme examples, art created by exploitation, used to exploit in any way or otherwise associated with such things do take away from it. I understand it's hard to hear that Channel Awesome and the Nostalgia Critic were built on such bad business practices after enjoying their content for so long, especially if you didn't see it coming, but I feel that's likely what most people are feeling in this situation. I think it's not a great reaction to then say you don't care how the blood diamonds are mined, just that they sparkle so nice. In the end the company practically stole from their artists and made their lives miserable, seemingly on purpose. It reminded me of how everyone felt during the RangerTalk days, and that wasn't even a thing that was supposed to pay the bills.

    I'm not saying it's bad to have enjoyed the Nostalgia Critic, or even to wish you had never found out the truth behind it. I'm just saying that watching it now, after the fact, is giving them money for doing bad things, while still doing those bad things.

    EDIT: Oh, and about JewWario. The issue there is again the black and white thing. He was a bad egg, though clearly with issues. He killed himself, so what do you do then? You can still point out what Channel Awesome did wrong with him. I don't feel the #ChangeTheChannel group were protecting him, aside from hiding his identity in the whole grooming cases mentioned. I honestly don't know how they should have handled that otherwise. Naming and shaming him years after his death would probably have been just as poorly received. In the end the only other mention about him was that someone wanted to hold an online memorial and he was shot down as they wanted to do something with it that would make them money. The one that wanted to hold the memorial clearly wasn't aware of the things JewWario had done, while those who wanted to turn the memorial into profit clearly did.
    Last edited by Raging Phoenix; 05-17-2018 at 03:35 AM.

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  11. #28
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    For the record, you can think Channel Awesome is abhorrent and also think Linkara is an ass.

    Source: me

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  13. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Question View Post
    For the record, you can think Channel Awesome is abhorrent and also think Linkara is an ass.

    Source: me
    Oh, yeah, totally. You can even think Linkara is an ass but still got mistreated by Channel Awesome. I personally don't think he's an ass, though he's terrible at delivering his lines (which you'd think he'd have learned after so many years). I enjoy his content, but I don't think he'd be great to hang around with.

  14. #30
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    BB, Rage pretty much beat me to a response, but he explained what I was trying to say. Like I said before, I like Doug's content. I'm still tempted to watch some of it even now. But the fact of the matter is that Channel Awesome owns the YouTube Channel that he posts his content on and every view that his content gets is money directly into Mike Michaud's pocket. And that was my point with the whole you can't separate the art from the artist in this instance. Because the artist's art is, essentially, funding a criminal empire (let's be honest, what Channel Awesome did during the Crowd Funding Debacle was 100% illegal and they got off on a technicality), I cannot support the artist and enjoy his art. Unfortunately, in this instance, the art is tied directly into the artist's decisions as there is really only one way to enjoy and appreciate the art. Now if someone were to, admittedly illegally, upload Doug's content on a channel that isn't owned by Channel Awesome, I would probably watch it. Not that I condone illegal acquisition of media... >.>


    And as far as derailing the thread is concerned, don't worry about it. Number One, this is civil discourse, so no harm there. Secondly, the whole #ChangeTheChannel is entirely relevant to the thread's topic.


    Jigaku No Banken!

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